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Thread: Consumption & Recycle Tax and Other Charges.

  1. #21

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    Quote Originally Posted by Boyblue View Post
    I am not being charged a bid fee, I was just curious what this bid fee is?

    As seen on ASnet site 入札料

    What is the nature of this bid fee? Is it proxy bidding?
    I do not use ASnet so I do not know the exact details of their charges.

    ASnet is a third party auction site that gathers the information from auction houses around Japan and places it on one website for dealers and agents in Japan to use. Dealers and Agents can join ASnet and they can then bid on vehicles through the ASnet site. However, the auction fee that ASnet charges is a lot more compared to buying directly from the auction because the buyer has to pay the normal auction house fee and ASnet's fee because ASnet is not offering the service for love.
    I think it costs around 10,000yen (I am not 100% sure) more buying through ASnet opposed to buying directly via the auction that is auctioning the vehicle.
    Agents who cannot get USS membership or membership to other auctions tend to use ASnet because obtaining ASnet membership is not hard, completely different to obtaining USS where USS want a pound of flesh before you can get membership.

    Whoever gave you access to ASnet, ask them to explain to you the inn's and outs of ASnet.

    Mark Bremner
    Brave Auto International - Japan Based Vehicle Exporter & Auction Agent - 20yrs Sourcing & Exporting Genuine Hi-Grade Vehicles to Customers Worldwide.

    Main Website / Japanese Auction Search Website / Facebook / Youtube

  2. #22

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mark - Brave Auto View Post
    It does not cost to bid on each car, as my original post, this is just another way some agents try to increase their profits when offering low agents fee.

    Cheers

    MB..
    Good question. False answer. Most of the wholesale vehicle auctions charge for placing bids by proxy (a few are free). This applies even when you have direct membership, not just through the aggregated systems.

    We're currently covering 160 auctions. It's impractical and unnecessary to have individual memberships to all of them when there are aggregation systems available.

  3. #23

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tsuchiyama View Post
    Good question. False answer. Most of the wholesale vehicle auctions charge for placing bids by proxy (a few are free). This applies even when you have direct membership, not just through the aggregated systems.

    We're currently covering 160 auctions. It's impractical and unnecessary to have individual memberships to all of them when there are aggregation systems available.
    So is the fee for each bid (by proxy) or is it for series of bids on a vehicle?

  4. #24

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    Each time we place a bid we're charged for it (unless it's one of the auctions that don't charge a bidding fee). For verification you can view it on the invoice that we get from the auction house.

  5. #25

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    Using proxy bidding means you don't have to employ as many agents, I'm sure the trade off is worth it. I can see why some exporters would consider this a general expense. I can also see why others would track this amount for each transaction and pass it on to the customer - especially if the customer set a purchase price limit.

    Do you budget in a certain amount of bid fee for each purchase and/or do you pass on all or part of the expense to the buyer?

  6. #26

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    We started exporting in the 1990's. Before the internet changed everything.

    We had 2 auction buyers who would physically go to the auctions and bring back their booty on car carriers at the end of the day. Even though they were experienced (one guy had several decades of experience) they would often mess up simply because you never knew the exact sale price when multiple bidders were all pressing the live bidding button at the same time. It taught us valuable lessons about live bidding.

    This is why we now place bids in advance:
    • Prevent Overbidding. The "live bidding" (repeatedly pressing the button) option doesn't allow us to accurately specify a bid limit. While this bidding option displays the current price before the button is pressed, with other bidders pressing their buttons at around the same time it is never clear what price your bid increment was added to. This means you can easily end up paying more than your limit. Even seasoned professional buyers get it wrong with this old system.


    • Prevent Technology Failure. While technology has improved dramatically over the last decade there can still be issues with real-time connections not being stable, dropouts, power failure etc. making real-time bidding less reliable than bidding in advance.


    • Prevent Human Error. With a busy office and the possibility of several auctions taking place at once there is always the chance of human error at the crucial moment the bid needs to be placed with real-time bidding.


    • Allow For Changes In Auction Schedules. While the auction houses estimate what time the vehicle will go to auction in reality the schedule will often change continually throughout the day and we don't know exactly when the vehicle will go to auction until it actually happens.


    Also live bidding is not scaleable when you're placing multiple bids for multiple clients in 100+ auctions. It suits the Japanese dealers who'll put lowball bids on many vehicles and when successful either flip them or put them on their lot. It's not suitable in our situation where clients want specific vehicles with a specific bid limit.

    On billing, we simply bill everything at actual cost (what we actually pay out) and then charge a flat Y50,000 service fee per vehicle. We've run this billing formula since the 1990's and it seems to work.

    Our rewards program then gives multi vehicle clients vehicles free of our normal service fee. i.e. clients just pay everything at cost and we don't charge for the work we do.

  7. #27

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mark - Brave Auto View Post
    Agents who cannot get USS membership or membership to other auctions tend to use ASnet because obtaining ASnet membership is not hard
    USS Carquest membership only covers around 28 auctions. ASNET, iAUC etc. provide coverage to the other 100+ auctions not covered by USS. They are complements to (not substitutes) for USS.

  8. #28

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tsuchiyama View Post
    Good question. False answer. Most of the wholesale vehicle auctions charge for placing bids by proxy (a few are free). This applies even when you have direct membership, not just through the aggregated systems.

    We're currently covering 160 auctions. It's impractical and unnecessary to have individual memberships to all of them when there are aggregation systems available.
    Quote Originally Posted by Tsuchiyama View Post
    We started exporting in the 1990's. Before the internet changed everything.

    We had 2 auction buyers who would physically go to the auctions and bring back their booty on car carriers at the end of the day. Even though they were experienced (one guy had several decades of experience) they would often mess up simply because you never knew the exact sale price when multiple bidders were all pressing the live bidding button at the same time. It taught us valuable lessons about live bidding.

    This is why we now place bids in advance:
    • Prevent Overbidding. The "live bidding" (repeatedly pressing the button) option doesn't allow us to accurately specify a bid limit. While this bidding option displays the current price before the button is pressed, with other bidders pressing their buttons at around the same time it is never clear what price your bid increment was added to. This means you can easily end up paying more than your limit. Even seasoned professional buyers get it wrong with this old system.


    • Prevent Technology Failure. While technology has improved dramatically over the last decade there can still be issues with real-time connections not being stable, dropouts, power failure etc. making real-time bidding less reliable than bidding in advance.


    • Prevent Human Error. With a busy office and the possibility of several auctions taking place at once there is always the chance of human error at the crucial moment the bid needs to be placed with real-time bidding.


    • Allow For Changes In Auction Schedules. While the auction houses estimate what time the vehicle will go to auction in reality the schedule will often change continually throughout the day and we don't know exactly when the vehicle will go to auction until it actually happens.


    Also live bidding is not scaleable when you're placing multiple bids for multiple clients in 100+ auctions. It suits the Japanese dealers who'll put lowball bids on many vehicles and when successful either flip them or put them on their lot. It's not suitable in our situation where clients want specific vehicles with a specific bid limit.

    On billing, we simply bill everything at actual cost (what we actually pay out) and then charge a flat Y50,000 service fee per vehicle. We've run this billing formula since the 1990's and it seems to work.

    Our rewards program then gives multi vehicle clients vehicles free of our normal service fee. i.e. clients just pay everything at cost and we don't charge for the work we do.
    Bids in advance also known as computer bid makes life easy for the agent because the computer at the auction bids for the agent but it is 101% not good for the customer because all agents know that a lot of the auctions tend to carry the bidding up to the max amount we have entered as our computer bid and then sell. Sometimes I have to use proxy bids because I cannot be in two places at once but I will avoid doing it as much as I can because I believe and what works best for me and my customers is live bidding.

    However, some agents do not care because they still get to charge their agents fee no mater whether the vehicle was secured well below the max budget or not.

    Yes, there is a charge for proxy bidding at certain auctions but it is minimal otherwise no one would bid or you would only bid if you thought you had a 90% chance of winning.

    As I also buy and sell back at auction, as a seller I would be cheesed off with the auctions if proxy bidding was expensive because as a seller I want as many bidders on my vehicle.

    Mark Bremner
    Brave Auto International - Japan Based Vehicle Exporter & Auction Agent - 20yrs Sourcing & Exporting Genuine Hi-Grade Vehicles to Customers Worldwide.

    Main Website / Japanese Auction Search Website / Facebook / Youtube

  9. #29

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tsuchiyama View Post
    USS Carquest membership only covers around 28 auctions. ASNET, iAUC etc. provide coverage to the other 100+ auctions not covered by USS. They are complements to (not substitutes) for USS.
    This thread that I spent the time to write out and make public to help importers is more about consumption tax and how agents offer a low agents fee and then make it up in other areas.

    This tread is not about the auctions themselves so by all means please go and start your own tread about how USS, ASNET and IAUC work and do not hijack my thread to promote your business.

    Regards

    Mark.

    Mark Bremner
    Brave Auto International - Japan Based Vehicle Exporter & Auction Agent - 20yrs Sourcing & Exporting Genuine Hi-Grade Vehicles to Customers Worldwide.

    Main Website / Japanese Auction Search Website / Facebook / Youtube

  10. #30

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mark - Brave Auto View Post
    Agents who cannot get USS membership or membership to other auctions tend to use ASnet because obtaining ASnet membership is not hard
    Readers might have got the impression that USS Carquest membership was the only membership that mattered and that other memberships were in some way inferior. The comment was made in this thread Mark.

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